Married to & Mired in Mourinho's Motley Mind

[Style And Glory]

I disliked the guy.
I'm open minded & don't hate but he made it easy to dislike.

As a person, I felt he was a miserable, egotistical SOB who spat venom & breathed fire whenever things wouldn't go his way.
As a coach, I felt he was someone who genuinely thought he was more important that any club he was at. After Porto, he depended more on money in order to win. He was a real-life Football Manager 2004-18. Money was no issue.
Yes he has won wherever he had gone but by the time he left he had scorched the earth around each club. At his most recent 3 clubs, has he left them in a better state than when he arrived?
We live in a results oriented society where club boards & fans want immediate returns. Being pragmatic, he adopted a win-at-all-cost approach which provided for some drab football. I didn't think he fit at United nor did its fans.

But now he is here.
We're married to him.
So now what?

I wouldn't accept the man as he was. But I want the club to succeed. So I'm conflicted. If you love the club do you need to like the manager / coach? I want to be proud of the club as a whole: top to bottom. Poch provided that. He transformed our club into an exciting outfit. We were winning & being entertained with some flair. And he seemed to genuinely be a terrific guy that others admired & opponents fans envied. I mean, look at L'Arse. Even they are begging their board to take him.

As for Mourinho, for me, he needed change. Football sense aside, might as as well have Piers Morgan manage the team.

So what has transpired since he's arrived?
Our player's performances have improved.
Our fans mood has improved.
Our results have improved.
And seemingly so has Jose.
His time away from the game & the spotlight has given him an opportunity to reflect & re-evaluate not only his tactical approach to the game but also his persona. I say persona because it's harder to change who you truly are than who you outwardly are.
I believe he realized he wouldn't get many more high profile positions if he continued as he had..

I have to commend him for that inspired moment during the Olympiakos match: replacing Dier at the 27 minute mark. Doing that mark's a significant difference between him & Poch. Poch was loyal to his players almost to a fault. It may have taken Poch until the 70th minute to replace Dier. But Mourinho realized what he had set up wasn't working & quickly took measures to correct it. The vast majority of us watching may have thought it was odd to replace him with Eriksen, someone who "didn't want to be here" & had habitually under-performed for so long. But it worked. By making a change so early, it essentially amounted to him admitting that he initially got it wrong (see "humble") but also had the balls & tactical nous to affect a positive outcome. He even protected Dier from any perceived humiliation afterwards.

And then there's that brilliant ball boy story line. It just keeps getting better.

Right now, for me he's saying & doing all the right things. This honeymoon phase has been pretty good if not remarkable.. Long may it continue.

He's winning me over.but I can't help looking over my shoulder & thinking "don't do this to yourself".

 

[Don Diaz]

A lot of interesting points. At WHL on Saturday, there was a much better mood than when we left after the Sheffield United game, but I feel a lot of the better humour and recognition of Mourinho is still tongue in cheek. In short it's way too early to judge. I don't have the facts because I've never been interested in the bloke, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was a 'honeymoon' period wherever he goes..... not sure how long that lasts? Popular belief is 18 months to 2 years and Levy has bought into that and his hugely successful track record.

We simply don't know, but the change in footballing style is very evident, with two 'long ball' Dele goals this weekend. I don't mind that as long as it's not route 1 for 90% of the time every week. In between the goals we played some nice stuff, then got complacent at 3-0 and nearly fucked it up. I'm also happy for him to fix the defence and teach the players how to close a game down, from memory, something we've never been able to do at Spurs in over 40 years? We would have won 2-0 at Arsenal had we had that skill.

In terms of liking the bloke, you really don't have to, Just support the team and the players, after all they're the ones who have to work for him and with whom we have more of a connection, unless you're a certain ballboy.... I didn't care much for Terry Neill, Jacques Santini, George Graham, AVB or Tim Sherwood. but they were our managers and I kept supporting the club rather than the bloke in the dugout.

If he brings us success, whilst playing attractive exciting football, perfect - that's what we all want right? If it turns out he genuinely has changed as a human being, well that would good too, We won't know for quite some time yet though and I'm not singing the 'Jose is a Yid' song anytime soon.

 

[Finchbee]

Dele has been the player of 2 years ago so Jose has done something...I didnt like him because of his media presentation but hes seems to be quite calm for NOW !

 

[Dorset]

Jose has been in charge for 3 games, I am totally neutral about the tosser, I don't hate him as much as I used to, he has nowhere nowhere near balanced the scales or swung the swingometer of arsehoelism. I will have another think about him at the end of the season, but I am not joining the excited fanboy club just yet.

 

[Style And Glory]

A lot of interesting points. At WHL on Saturday, there was a much better mood than when we left after the Sheffield United game, but I feel a lot of the better humour and recognition of Mourinho is still tongue in cheek. In short it's way too early to judge. I don't have the facts because I've never been interested in the bloke, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was a 'honeymoon' period wherever he goes..... not sure how long that lasts? Popular belief is 18 months to 2 years and Levy has bought into that and his hugely successful track record.

We simply don't know, but the change in footballing style is very evident, with two 'long ball' Dele goals this weekend. I don't mind that as long as it's not route 1 for 90% of the time every week. In between the goals we played some nice stuff, then got complacent at 3-0 and nearly fucked it up. I'm also happy for him to fix the defence and teach the players how to close a game down, from memory, something we've never been able to do at Spurs in over 40 years? We would have won 2-0 at Arsenal had we had that skill.

In terms of liking the bloke, you really don't have to, Just support the team and the players, after all they're the ones who have to work for him and with whom we have more of a connection, unless you're a certain ballboy.... I didn't care much for Terry Neill, Jacques Santini, George Graham, AVB or Tim Sherwood. but they were our managers and I kept supporting the club rather than the bloke in the dugout.

If he brings us success, whilst playing attractive exciting football, perfect - that's what we all want right? If it turns out he genuinely has changed as a human being, well that would good too, We won't know for quite some time yet though and I'm not singing the 'Jose is a Yid' song anytime soon.

It is early Don, but like I said, so far so good. We are 3 for 3 & it hasn't been drab at all. I't all been rather enjoyable. He's only had less than 2 weeks to work with the team so he's been keeping it simple for now & utilizing players to their strengths. He's given a number of players a chance to show what they can do but I do hope Lo Celso is given more time. Lots of media running with the story that he's not happy & may leave in next month. Let's see if he wants him & alleviates the problem.

 

[Style And Glory]

Dele has been the player of 2 years ago so Jose has done something...I didnt like him because of his media presentation but hes seems to be quite calm for NOW !

He seems to understand Dele & has given him the freedom to roam & play instinctively.

Calm Day +12 & counting. When we start counting down, it's time to worry.

 

[Finchbee]

He seems to understand Dele & has given him the freedom to roam & play instinctively.

Calm Day +12 & counting. When we start counting down, it's time to worry.

Didnt Southgate say its playing him as a 10 ?

 

[J.spurs]

I'm not going to pretend I like Mourinho, but I'm also not going to slate him already when we start seeing some bad results. I think it's hard to judge much about the manager from the run of results we've gotten, which I obviously hope continue.

At this point, I'm still pretty much ignoring him.

 

[skiathospurs]

Disclaimer;Mourinho is a cunt and deep down I probably know he always will be,so when things go bad I reserve the right to put the boot in as much as anyone else.

That said even before 2 weeks ago when he came to spurs,the last year,seeing him commenting on games as a pundit,I found myself suprised at his knowledge of the game (especially as he wasnt a player,more on that later),even surrounded by glory hole pundits like souness,redknapp judas jnr,mr spitty (as my missus calls him),smash her back doors in Keys,andy gray,red nev,he was always eloquent,controlled as all around him just talked....well bollocks as is their remit.And trying not to feel like a hypocrite as one who has sung on the shelf some quite unmentionable things about him (as with George graham and wenger),I grudgingly accepted he sort of knew his onions.

As a person I try to be optimistic about life in general,and spurs as well,the next result can always turn it around,next season will always be better,even if we were playing the Brasil of 1970 in the maracana with the 97 side I would think we could win.Yes I can fall into dark moods and defeatism,but try to negate that with gallows humour and a shrug rather than a full on childs tantrum meltdowns.In the immediate aftermath of Poch`s sacking some friends emailed and said didnt see that coming who do you want?my reply was anyone but "jose buswankerdinosaurus" .So thats where I stood.The morning of his appointment I emailed my missus who is back in sweden following her mothers death saying I couldnt believe we had hired mourinho,"oh no" was sort of the jist of her reply..

So thats where I was coming from,I can take all the happy clapper,fanboy jokes because underlying is my feeling i will feel like the above again at sometime in the future.

BUT
In 2 weeks he has or I have allowed myself to see the positives,two of which are I dont hate him as much as terry neil and george graham who were both managers during my time going,so its not the worst appoinment.As I said he clearly knows his stuff about setting up teams to beat other teams,what legacy he leaves is or has been very different,he makes here&now happen,its not like Jol or Poch laying foundations,its more like redknapp to an extent,just not as cute and cuddly.And before i write too much I think his year away,working in the media has helped focus a new Jose,who lets face it the last year at Man utd looked like a tramp,he went from richard gere in pretty women to shane in shameless.
Seemingly gone is the arrogance in its worst form but not the self belief,he looks to have studied and appointed some very good coaches,his man management is more like Poch`s tactile and friendly and the worst fear of boring football "one nil to the tottenham" seems as far away as with ossie.Throw in some entertaining wins,the chelsea judas hatred of him now,and as everyone to a man has said,he is saying all the right things.He seems to accept we will never love him like Poch (or not for a very long time) but is acting as Mr Tottenham dare i say as much as any manager two weeks into his tenure,
The fact he was never a player allows him to deal with players without ego,how did hoddle ever hold training and not think even at 50 he could things those players never could at their peak,so i think he values team above individual skill,much like poch.Also he has had to study and learn football as a scholar because he didnt play,so he sees the field as a chess board,pieces to be manipulated and why he has always been so effective at stopping/exploiting other teams,if Ole sets up his team tactically better than Jose tonight I wlll be astounded,doesnt mean for sure we will win,but he is an advantage over a novice.
And finally it could just be he has a "thing" for spurs,he was the visitng manager on one of the most remarkable days in our history,who could not have failed to have us in their heart being there 1st hand to experience "the finale" except the most dogeared fans of a london rival.The support,and history on show that amazing historical afternoon cant have gone unfelt??

So while I probably wont sing his name ever?I will back him,because I want us to win,so i want him to win.So bear with me if i do sound like i am fully converted to the dark side at times.I dont want to have to think about eventually turning on him,but I well could,unfair because thats in his history.I thought the same with willie gallas and have nothing but good things to say about his spell with us,and then I tried to feel the same with ade,but really just couldnt in the end.Depends on Mourinho,what he does,how he acts...

over to you Jose.

 

[Style And Glory]

Well articulated @skiathospurs.
Very similar sentiments.
Thanks for sharing.

I'm really looking forward to today's match.

 

[Yid]

Disclaimer;Mourinho is a cunt and deep down I probably know he always will be,so when things go bad I reserve the right to put the boot in as much as anyone else.

That said even before 2 weeks ago when he came to spurs,the last year,seeing him commenting on games as a pundit,I found myself suprised at his knowledge of the game (especially as he wasnt a player,more on that later),even surrounded by glory hole pundits like souness,redknapp judas jnr,mr spitty (as my missus calls him),smash her back doors in Keys,andy gray,red nev,he was always eloquent,controlled as all around him just talked....well bollocks as is their remit.And trying not to feel like a hypocrite as one who has sung on the shelf some quite unmentionable things about him (as with George graham and wenger),I grudgingly accepted he sort of knew his onions.

As a person I try to be optimistic about life in general,and spurs as well,the next result can always turn it around,next season will always be better,even if we were playing the Brasil of 1970 in the maracana with the 97 side I would think we could win.Yes I can fall into dark moods and defeatism,but try to negate that with gallows humour and a shrug rather than a full on childs tantrum meltdowns.In the immediate aftermath of Poch`s sacking some friends emailed and said didnt see that coming who do you want?my reply was anyone but "jose buswankerdinosaurus" .So thats where I stood.The morning of his appointment I emailed my missus who is back in sweden following her mothers death saying I couldnt believe we had hired mourinho,"oh no" was sort of the jist of her reply..

So thats where I was coming from,I can take all the happy clapper,fanboy jokes because underlying is my feeling i will feel like the above again at sometime in the future.

BUT
In 2 weeks he has or I have allowed myself to see the positives,two of which are I dont hate him as much as terry neil and george graham who were both managers during my time going,so its not the worst appoinment.As I said he clearly knows his stuff about setting up teams to beat other teams,what legacy he leaves is or has been very different,he makes here&now happen,its not like Jol or Poch laying foundations,its more like redknapp to an extent,just not as cute and cuddly.And before i write too much I think his year away,working in the media has helped focus a new Jose,who lets face it the last year at Man utd looked like a tramp,he went from richard gere in pretty women to shane in shameless.
Seemingly gone is the arrogance in its worst form but not the self belief,he looks to have studied and appointed some very good coaches,his man management is more like Poch`s tactile and friendly and the worst fear of boring football "one nil to the tottenham" seems as far away as with ossie.Throw in some entertaining wins,the chelsea judas hatred of him now,and as everyone to a man has said,he is saying all the right things.He seems to accept we will never love him like Poch (or not for a very long time) but is acting as Mr Tottenham dare i say as much as any manager two weeks into his tenure,
The fact he was never a player allows him to deal with players without ego,how did hoddle ever hold training and not think even at 50 he could things those players never could at their peak,so i think he values team above individual skill,much like poch.Also he has had to study and learn football as a scholar because he didnt play,so he sees the field as a chess board,pieces to be manipulated and why he has always been so effective at stopping/exploiting other teams,if Ole sets up his team tactically better than Jose tonight I wlll be astounded,doesnt mean for sure we will win,but he is an advantage over a novice.
And finally it could just be he has a "thing" for spurs,he was the visitng manager on one of the most remarkable days in our history,who could not have failed to have us in their heart being there 1st hand to experience "the finale" except the most dogeared fans of a london rival.The support,and history on show that amazing historical afternoon cant have gone unfelt??

So while I probably wont sing his name ever?I will back him,because I want us to win,so i want him to win.So bear with me if i do sound like i am fully converted to the dark side at times.I dont want to have to think about eventually turning on him,but I well could,unfair because thats in his history.I thought the same with willie gallas and have nothing but good things to say about his spell with us,and then I tried to feel the same with ade,but really just couldnt in the end.Depends on Mourinho,what he does,how he acts...

over to you Jose.

Fucking fangirl.....

 

[skiathospurs]

Fucking fangirl.....

I feel like I`ve dumped charlize theron and started fucking helen mirren.

Fuck me I could have saved all that typing.....

 

[NiceOneCyril]

This is a wonderful thread!

Finally we are able to express and truly share our conflicted feelings in a liberating and empowering manner. Reading this as I drink my matcha tea is great preparation for this afternoon's bikram yoga session and book club reading of Little Fires Everywhere (with its themes of motherhood, identity and the crippling weight of secrets kept). I am soaring.

Thank you everyone, especially Jose Mourinho. If he continues with his highest win percentage of any THFC manager ever, we will be challenging for the premier league title and guaranteed to win both the FA Cup and the Champions League in 2020.

Of course if we lose tonight then it's back to absinthe, Henrik Ibsen, bring back Poch and being a miserable cunt to everyone I know. Just as empowering in its own way. Fucking football.

 

[skiathospurs]

This is a wonderful thread!

Finally we are able to express and truly share our conflicted feelings in a liberating and empowering manner. Reading this as I drink my matcha tea is great preparation for this afternoon's bikram yoga session and book club reading of Little Fires Everywhere (with its themes of motherhood, identity and the crippling weight of secrets kept). I am soaring.

Thank you everyone, especially Jose Mourinho. If he continues with his highest win percentage of any THFC manager ever, we will be challenging for the premier league title and guaranteed to win both the FA Cup and the Champions League in 2020.

Of course if we lose tonight then it's back to absinthe, Henrik Ibsen, bring back Poch and being a miserable cunt to everyone I know. Just as empowering in its own way. Fucking football.

Lose tonight??fuck it Lord of the Flies time.

 

[Yid]

Lose tonight??fuck it Lord of the Flies time.

Pigggggyyyyyyy.....!!!!

 

[Style And Glory]

Pigggggyyyyyyy.....!!!!

Is that Jack in the distance?

 

[Style And Glory]

Ahh, it was just Ralph.

 

[skiathospurs]

Ahh, it was just Ralph.

Dont worry Jack will be here soon enough

 

[Style And Glory]

JM gave the match ball to 17 year old Troy Parrott for making his PL debut.

"He's debuted at 17 years old, debut in the Premier League," said Mourinho when asked to explain why he'd done that (taken the ball from Son)..

"Sometimes [the ball] is for the guy who scores the hat-trick. I think a much bigger meaning is for a 17-year-old boy that last week was playing in youth Champions League with kids of his age and today played in the Premier League."

Seems odd to use the phrase "a touch of class" when referring to JM?

For the time being, I feel Jack is in a straitjacket & Piggy is safe. For now.

 

[Style And Glory]

With comments & gestures like the one's above, sometimes you forget what looms below the the surface of JM's facade.

Just sayin'.

 

[Dorset]

16 goals in 5 games - this bloke is trying to fuck with my brain. How can I keep hating him?

 

[Yid]

16 goals in 5 games - this bloke is trying to fuck with my brain. How can I keep hating him?

Mate.... it's the dark side. Its powerful shit, don't be seduced.

Don't tell me you of all people are crumbling after a handful of games.....?

 

[skiathospurs]

Mate.... it's the dark side. Its powerful shit, don't be seduced.

Don't tell me you of all people are crumbling after a handful of games.....?

 

[Dorset]

Mate.... it's the dark side. Its powerful shit, don't be seduced.

Don't tell me you of all people are crumbling after a handful of games.....?

Nah, it will take a lot longer for me to not hate him, but I must be getting more mellow in my old age because for the first time ever, there is a remote possibility that there is very tiny, slight chance that someone might be removed from my list - this has never happened before..

 

[Yid]

Nah, it will take a lot longer for me to not hate him, but I must be getting more mellow in my old age because for the first time ever, there is a remote possibility that there is very tiny, slight chance that someone might be removed from my list - this has never happened before..

I can only assume that he will be in pole position to be returned to the top of the list once he shits the bed and burns our club to the ground....?

 

[Dorset]

I can only assume that he will be in pole position to be returned to the top of the list once he shits the bed and burns our club to the ground....?

He would probably move up the list if I read anything he said or listened to his interviews - I ain't going there. We don't have to love the manager, it's nice and I enjoyed it with the Poch, but it's not needed. I never got arsed with the Harry gobbing off sessions that seemed to upset the chaps in the other place. It's easy, if you don't like what someone is saying just ignore them.

 

[skiathospurs]

Lets face it,in 70 years I reckon we have had 4 managers who have left the club in a truly better place,and two of them didnt win any trophys.Since Bill Nic I would say only Burkinshaw,jol and Pochettino have improved the club internally,or left it in a substantially better position than when they arrived to go forward.Dont give me venables,pleat or redknapp,yes they played tasty football,but what they assembled was there&then as the years following showed.
So lets face it Jose is on a hiding to nothing,even if he wins a cup,improving the stature is easier,but a legacy,history suggests almost impossible unless russian roubles are involved or middle east petro dollars.But Jol and Poch should give us hope it is possible.

Saying that a bit of here&now wouldnt go amiss.

 

[Yid]

Soz mate Redknap moved us forwards....
We were heading for the fucking championship, he stopped the rot and brought in players who he knew could add to the mix and make us better....

He gave us our first glimpses of glory for many many years, and delivered the CL to WHL....

Not saying it was perfect, as it certainly wasnt but he delivered more than Jol and Poch IMO and I loved both those guys.

 

[Dorset]

He's a cunt, but he's our cunt?

 

[Don Diaz]

Soz mate Redknap moved us forwards....
We were heading for the fucking championship, he stopped the rot and brought in players who he knew could add to the mix and make us better....

He gave us our first glimpses of glory for many many years, and delivered the CL to WHL....

Not saying it was perfect, as it certainly wasnt but he delivered more than Jol and Poch IMO and I loved both those guys.

I agree - more than Jol but not more than Poch?